Culture, Comms, & Cocktails is internal comms served straight up, so settle in, and drink in the knowledge. Some shaken, some stirred, and maybe even some with a twist, and enjoy the top shelf guest I have lined up for you. I’m your host, Chuck Gose, Senior Strategic Advisor at SocialChorus. On this episode of the podcast, we have Alex Rose, Director of Digital Communication at Magellan Health.
Magellan Health is a leader in managing the fastest growing, most complex areas of health, including special populations, complete pharmacy benefits and other specialty areas of healthcare. Magellan supports innovative ways of accessing better health through technology, while remaining focused on the critical personal relationships that are necessary to achieve a healthy, vibrant life.
This is sort of the first time I’ve been able to very confidently go to people and say, ‘Listen, I have the tools and the data that you need, here’s how we can help.’
Culture, Comms, & Cocktails Episode 42 Transcript
Chuck Gose: Hello everyone. This is Culture, Comms and Cocktails; internal comms served straight up. I’m your host, Chuck Gose, Senior Strategic Advisor at SocialChorus. On this episode of the podcast, we have Alex Rose, Director of Digital Communication at Magellan Health. Welcome to the podcast, Alex.
Alex Rose: Thank you. Thanks for having me.
Chuck Gose: So first off, during the pandemic I always want to check in one on people. So Alex, how are you and the people you care about doing during the pandemic?
Alex Rose: We’re doing good. Yeah, as best as can be expected. I think, like everybody else on planet earth, we’re a little stir-crazy at this point, but it’s been a wild year for us. We welcomed my second child this year at the height of the pandemic here in Connecticut. So he was born in a hospital on lockdown with an army base set up in the parking lot, as my wife reminded me today, on the worst day of the pandemic numbers in Connecticut, so at its very peak. It’s been a little interesting welcoming him to the world in a very different world from what we normally experience. But I got to say, we’re doing very well and we’ve been very lucky in regards to how this has affected us.
Chuck Gose: Well, certainly he will have stories to share and he will probably grow tired as he gets older of hearing you and your wife share the stories of him. It reminds me of the people that were born during the blizzard of 78, there’s drama around it.
Chuck Gose: It’s great to hear that everybody’s doing well. With Magellan Health being in healthcare, how is the organization holding up? Obviously you said being in Connecticut and East Coast, feeling that initial surge before probably the rest of the country did and now experiencing this, as we all have, with these recent surges, how’s the organization doing?
Alex Rose: Again, I think we’re doing well. It was a very fast set of events that were happening this spring. We were talking about this a while back internally about the scale of what we had to do. We’re a national company, we have offices all over the country. Start of the pandemic we were about 40% work from home, so it wasn’t unheard of. We had some infrastructure in place for work from home, but we were not a work from home company. In less than a week, we went to being 90% plus work from home, which, I mean, shout out to our IT and HR teams. They did an incredible job of just getting us up and running.
Alex Rose: And then being a healthcare company, we have a bit of an advantage over a lot of companies in that if we need to get medical advice or if our CEO needs to ask a doctor’s opinion, I think he pretty much leans backwards in his chair and shouts outside his office door because there’s about five sitting right there. We have an amazing clinical team who I’ve been advising the whole company as we’ve gone through.
Alex Rose: One of the things that we stuck with was working from home, when I think a lot of companies went back and have now had to go back to working from home as we’ve had this second wave. We never did that. We continue to isolate and stay working at home, which has been very successful. In fact, in some cases, we’ve made those changes permanently. It happened to me. The office I was working in is has closed, but we’re all still here. We’re all working through Zoom and through Social Course. It’s been, I think, as smooth a transition as any of us could possibly have hoped for.
Chuck Gose: So for those who might not be familiar with who Magellan Health is, give us the quick pitch on the company.
Alex Rose: So we are a health insurance company effectively. We tend to specialize in things like behavioral health and specialty health, pharmacy benefits management. We may not be the first person that people hear of. In many cases they have our services through a different health insurance provider, but our basic pitch is we take all the most difficult parts of healthcare and take care of it for other companies.
Chuck Gose: Yeah, as I’ve chatted with other communicators during this pandemic, it seemed like communicators that were closest to healthcare or in healthcare were the most prepared when it came to changing communication and changing plans. So how did Magellan Health’s 2020 plans change beyond simply working from home? What was supposed to happen and didn’t happen or what has happened as a result of?
Alex Rose: This is probably familiar even outside of healthcare, that beautiful calendar of messaging that we put together in 2019 for this year, yeah, that got thrown out pretty much. That was gone. I think we got through one quarter, maybe half a quarter of that before we realized things have to change.
Alex Rose: Again, we have clinicians on staff and they really rose to the occasion for us. So we were literally getting clinicians to do videos explaining even the basics at the start, like what is coronavirus? I mean, most people, if they’d heard of it, it was a tiny bit of print on the back of a Lysol bottle or something like that. Talking about masks, talking about the importance of social distancing, things like that.
Alex Rose: So we switched quite quickly to producing a series of videos and then articles. And then we could actually share that burden with our marketing team and our external communications crew, which also includes me. I do both internal and external. And so we were sharing that content with our clients, with our individual members people who utilize Magellan Health, like insurance services and things like that, then our employees. That was like the big shift that we had in terms of what we were going to say. We had all these beautiful things that we’re going to talk about, and hopefully we’ll talk about some of them in 2021. It was much more important to talk about the epidemic and what was going on and really explaining out a very complex set of circumstances.
Alex Rose: Having said that, we’re still a large company, we still have earnings calls, town halls, product launches, the world kept ticking as well. So part of our challenge was really trying to weave those two things together, which hopefully we did successfully. I think we did. And try and integrate that thought leadership and that guidance from our clinical stuff into really everything that we do while keeping the lights on and keeping everything going. More than keeping the lights on, keeping ourselves prospering and growing.
Alex Rose: So it was a challenge. I would love to revisit what I thought I was going to be doing in 2019 and see how few boxes I checked off. But I think it was a success nonetheless.
Chuck Gose: Yeah, I’ll be curious if there’s any pet projects that got shelved by communicators that they now revisit, or have there been new projects that have popped up as a result of us all going through this new critical communication out there.
Alex Rose: Yeah. I mean, I think from our perspective, this coincided with us making some changes to our internal communications and in many ways that was probably a blessing in disguise. You hate to really say anything positive about the pandemic or 2020 in general, I think for most people, but it really made us place some bats in terms of what we were doing in terms of communications, but it also gave us some strong opportunities to demonstrate what we were doing and why it was important and that our thinking, or 2019 hypothetical thinking was actually right.
Alex Rose: I don’t know that I’d always want to throw anything through a stress test like that, but it definitely folded in, I think, quite well with what we had been thinking we should be doing. I suppose the best way to find something out is to go out there and try it.
Chuck Gose: One of the things, the organization conducted surveys with employees to find out about what their interests were and what their needs were. So what was the impetus behind doing the surveys? What did you find out? What were the results and did it lead to some of those changes you just talked about?
Alex Rose: Yeah, so my background’s in external comms and as is my boss, Lily. Due some changes in staff and things like that, Lily ended up taking over the internal comms at Magellan as well. We took a look at things and what we found, essentially was, I think this is probably true of quite a lot of places, is that organically over time, we’re a very big company, different parts of the company had picked up different methods of communicating and in the here and now that often was working quite well. Inside an organization, you always have silos and inside those silos, things were running pretty smoothly.
Alex Rose: One of the things that we were seeing and we were hearing in feedback from employees was outside of those silos people were really struggling to find what the company message was, what was going on. We’re very privileged in that we have actually a team at Magellan that specializes in this kind of survey. So we went to them and said, “Please help. Let’s find out what’s going on.” We have about 10,000 employees. We surveyed all 10,000 employees and basically we just asked them. We had different communication platforms, one was SocialChorus, which we had been using for a couple of years. One was a product from Facebook, and then one was probably the one that everyone uses the most, which was Outlook email. We had a significant number of people who were just operating in Outlook, maybe augmenting that a little bit with Teams or a chat tool or something like that to try and spread the message.
Alex Rose: The net result of what we found was there was a lot of confusion and there were a lot of folks who had very strong opinions about different tools. Some people love a social media experience. They really like to create their own content, the input. Some people just hate that experience. They don’t treat it as something serious. So many people that we heard from were just like, “I don’t have time. I’m busy, I’m stressed out. I don’t have time to go to somewhere. Can you just email me when you’re ready?”
Alex Rose: I think the challenge that it rose was, well, how do you do that? If your survey is telling you I both love and hate social media, it’s hard to commit to a social media platform. If people are saying they both love and hate email, it’s hard to find a platform in the middle.
Alex Rose: The net net of this is we decided to consolidate everything down onto SocialChorus, what we call Magellan Now, our Magellan Now platform. The net net was what do people want? They want everything and that’s kind of what Magellan Now does. I mean, we have a web experience, we have a mobile app, it’s our email program. And if people want to have a social experience, we let them do that. We have social channels, we have commenting, we have spaces where they can contribute their own content. So we made that decision, I think, about a week before the pandemic really came in. So yeah, since about June we have been consolidating everything down progressively into working purely through SocialChorus on our Magellan Now platform.
Chuck Gose: So driving this consolidated digital employee experience, how have you felt that efficiency or how has that benefited others in your organization now with there being that one platform where everything’s going versus does it go over here? Does fit over here? What is it over here? How has that helped the team?
Alex Rose: Efficiency is the key word. I think our biggest challenge was we have 10,000 employees. Our communications team for internal comms is four people. What I was describing before, if we had a key message, the administrative work to deliver that key message is enormous. We were working on SocialChorus, we were working on our Facebook product, we were creating emails in a separate program. We were having to reach out and do talking points, things like that, to make sure that message was getting out accurately. And in some cases, the accuracy is extremely important. I mean, obviously healthcare, we are a regulated industry. We’re a publicly traded company. You can’t be ambiguous about some things like that. You have to get the exact wording out. So, it was a challenge. So creating a message was really we’re creating five or six messages to get out there.
Alex Rose: Being able to consolidate that down to truly having the experience where one of our comms employees can write an article, it publishes to the web, it publishes to the app, we use content amplifiers in some of our internal portals and things like that, it publishes there. It quickly turns, either automatically or with very little intervention, into an email that we can send out to our inbox loving friends. On occasion we’ve even done a push notification to go along with it.
Alex Rose: Being able to do that in one consolidated place with, still it amazes me, surprisingly few clicks to get all of that out there, it allows us as a communications team to focus not on administrative work, but on working with leadership on what should messages be, working with our partners around the company to make sure that we are doing everything that we need to in terms of messaging around compliance, regulatory compliance, or security. Which again, as a healthcare company is extremely important that we’re on top of those things both from a personal health information and then just regular IT security where obviously we could be a target of security incidents and things like that. So we just have to be very, very careful.
Alex Rose: We’ve got some great partners and really in the last six months, we’ve been able to focus on working with them as opposed to sitting in Excel and trying to create email lists excluding certain groups because they were using something else and the number of headaches that we’ve had have just disappeared.
Chuck Gose: Well, that’s awesome to hear. I mean, that’s exactly what we want is the comms team to be more facilitating communication and driving out comms and not always focused on the outputs. Something I’m curious about is when you did this survey, obviously employees told you whether they love the social media aspect, or they hated the social media aspect, but what were some of the things that you learned about employees during the pandemic that maybe, the survey, you said, was done before, but what have you learned about the culture and the employees at Magellan Health during this difficult time?
Alex Rose: Well, we know what everybody’s living room looks like now. But seriously, actually on that note, seriously though, I think one of the things that we have learned is how resilient our employees are and how able they are to rise to the occasion. One of our core values as a company, if you go to Magellanhealth.com or go to our career site, you’ll see us talk about this, is what we call work-life flow. It has always been a key attribute about being a Magellan employee and being part of this team, which is this idea that real life happens and we work around it. So we try and make sure that employees feel supported, they’re able to carry on with both their work life and their home life, that they’re equally important. It’s something that Magellan has always been good about. When we were mapping out our values, that was one that people really gravitated to and we did that as an internal process.
Alex Rose: What’s been amazing to see is, and I hope all companies can say this, and I know that that’s probably not true, that not all companies can say this, is that it’s not just a slogan on our website, that this has worked really well. Schools closed, daycare centers closed, all of a sudden people were working at home where they didn’t have a dedicated space to work from home. Their children are around. And I think in maybe a lesser company and a company that was struggling with that concept more, you could see just everything coming off the rails and it really hasn’t. We’ve managed to work it out. Having to give everybody a crash course in how to use Zoom and getting folks set up with home computers and things like that, I’ve been amazed and just so impressed with how well 10,000 people have suddenly changed their lives around and accommodated all of this external stress on top of their workload. It’s really been incredible to work.
Alex Rose: I’m very proud of it. To be in a culture like this, it doesn’t just happen. It really does take a lot of work and I think one of the things that’s just been amazing to see over the last 10 months is that work really pay off. It’s really been remarkable. So it’s been a wild ride, but I think we’re doing well.
Chuck Gose: You mentioned that that work-life flow. And obviously that speaks to employees who are already ingrained in the Magellan Health culture. I’ve also learned that, and I love creative use cases of how to use internal comms and the SocialChorus platform in creative ways, that Magellan Now is a key part of onboarding new employees. Talk about the idea behind that and how you set that up.
Alex Rose: Yeah, actually, I love this program. I sort of own the Magellan Now platform and one of the things that we saw in our survey, particularly from newer employees, is it’s sort of fallen out of the orientation process. It hadn’t had an owner for a little while I think, and we were talking to new employees and they were like, “Okay, this sounds great. What is Magellan Now? Where do I go? How do I get there?” It was clear that we needed to be more upfront with new employees and talk about this process.
Alex Rose: I’ve mentioned before we’re a healthcare company. When you join Magellan, you have to go through a number of training and orientations. We have to talk to you about HIPAA, we have to talk to you about security, you have to learn all of our systems. If after 2020, maybe we go back to offices, you got to learn where the break room is and how to clock in and all of that. I really didn’t want to do another orientation where it’s like, “Hi, I’m Alex. This is the communications platform. Let me sit you down for an hour and show you how it works.” I very much feel like if we’re working that way, it’s not working, it’s not a good platform.
Alex Rose: So we knew we had to do something to get people on board. At the same time, we had a new department at Magellan, which is our onboardings coaching team. So when you joined Magellan, you end up with one of our coaches who basically guides you through your first few months of employment to make sure that you’re settled in well and you have everything you need and everything’s working well for you. We worked with Social Chorus, they helped us put together a special onboarding campaign so that coach’s content is sent through automatic emails over the first eight weeks. So it automates an awful lot of work for the coaches. They don’t have to be sending the same email over and over again.
Alex Rose: For us in communications, we love it because it’s a great way to teach people how to use Magellan Now organically without making them sit through another orientation session. So the goal is they start getting these emails, they start seeing the content, it gives them the opportunity to go and explore that content and that they can learn that they can find all of the content they want at any time that they need in the web experience, which again, falls back into that sort of work-life flow thing. Maybe 8:30 AM on a Monday morning is not the best time for you to be getting this critical information. You can get it at any time. You don’t need to wait for emails, you don’t need to only experience the communications from leadership in that way. You can go in and get any time and it’s paying off.
Alex Rose: So we’re seeing that retention in our users. We’ve been growing over the last, oh gosh, six, seven months now and we’re getting people to come back organically. We also do a weekly automated email that we send out, which has all of our top stories in it. What’s been really nice to see over the last few months is at the start of that, our email was far and away the number one source of viewers in our experience. But over the last few months, our web experience has been creeping up and up and up until they’re about equal, which I think means we’re just retaining those people. They’re learning to come back to the web experience and when they’re there, they’re clicking through and reading things. So we’ve actually seen our readership get up to its highest level that it’s ever been that we’ve been able to measure it.
Chuck Gose: Yeah. That’s awesome because I was thinking you’ve got to be getting some great data out of this onboarding stuff, because as you shared, it’s one thing it’s teaching them about the organization and they’re getting this information from these onboarding coaches, but then they get the data around how long they’re sticking around and what they’re coming back for is great. So we we’ve seen that obviously comms has benefited from Magellan Now, and now onboarding has been strengthened through Magellan Now. How have you empowered other parts of the business to take advantage of Magellan Now and how have they benefited from it?
Alex Rose: Yeah, so we really have been sort of campaigning to other departments in the last few months, now that we’ve got ourselves set up and settled and we’re starting to see that first with our benefits team. You know, it’s coming to the end of the year, it’s benefits season and we switched all of our benefits comms to using the SocialChorus this year. So we’re working with them. One of the key things I love about that is we’re able to use initiatives to tie everything together. At the end of this, for the first time, we’re actually going to be able to provide a wholistic set of data as to how their campaign did internally. What percentage of people saw it? What percentage interacted with it? Through whatever medium that that they want.
Alex Rose: And then hopefully next year it will be able to custom tailor things even more now that we have that foundation of data to work from to give them. I think they’re probably our most important customer internally. Their work is going to be our busiest months, I think, every year. We’re going to get the highest level of interaction just because of the nature of benefits. So that data is truly invaluable and the initiative concept, which ties everything together, I think, is a phenomenal way of doing it.
Alex Rose: Similarly, we’ve been working with our IT folks and our security and compliance folks. Part of that is just broadcasting their messages and I think we now can say we have the fastest and most efficient tool for communicating with all of our employees. So for our IT folks, very often, that’s just for real life stuff. Maybe there’s a security issue, we need to do a quick update or we’ve got a system outage or a VPN outage or something. They just need to send a note. We’ve given them the ability to pretty much instantly alert everybody.
Alex Rose: Similarly, they were very Outlook focused group at the start, which inevitably ends up in a scenario where they were having to send multiple messages for the same issue. They would come up with a fix and then they would need to amend that and they’d have to send messages, which if you’re relying on inboxes for people to find the right message and do the right things is hazardous. So one of the things they’ve been able to do is switch that to using articles on Magellan Now, which means we can quickly erase the thing that needs to be updated and put in the new information. When folks start clicking on those old links, it always takes them to the right information.
Alex Rose: And then similarly with our security and compliance folks, sometimes they need to send an alert and then they work with us all through the year to make sure that we’re aware of threats to the company. They test us to make sure that we’re not exposing the company to the threats, things like that. So we’re actually starting to take advantage of smart campaigns, especially the mandatory read button that we can put into articles just to say, “Let’s just make sure that not only are people seeing these articles, that they’re actually paying attention to them, they’re actually interacting with them,” because for us, in a regulated company, it’s critically important that they do so.
Alex Rose: So more of that to come, we’re really just getting started. But really this is sort of the first time I’ve been able to very confidently go to people and say, “Listen, I have the tools and the data that you need, here’s how we can help.” So we’re very excited about what we’re going to be doing over the next couple of months.
Chuck Gose: Yeah, it was cool to hear you talk about initiatives. I’m a huge fan of initiatives in the product, because again, it focuses more on the outcomes. What’s the impact we’ve had versus just the outputs? What have we sent? What have people clicked on? You’re able to bring all that together.
Chuck Gose: And then you mentioned the benefits team. I do find it somewhat humorous, I think, to think of an insurance company going through their own enrollment. So hopefully you’re fine tuning that process for the rest of us. And then I know another key point of success for Magellan Now, and anybody that’s listened to this podcast at any point in time knows that I am a super fan of employee generated content and allowing employees to participate and share. You had mentioned early on that there are some populations of your employees that love creating content. Companies may not always love what they create, they love creating it. So quickly, how has that played a role in the success of Magellan Now?
Alex Rose: Oh, I think it’s been critical. I really do. One of the things that we saw in the data that we look at in and in our surveying was with our Facebook product, which essentially replicated Facebook, the web experience in a workplace environment, was that the people that were using it were really using it mostly for social means, but they were really dedicated to using it. They were power users and they were the people that sold the most potential there. So we didn’t want to abandon them. They had really committed to using it.
Alex Rose: Then one of the big things, and I think it’s a challenge that any company is going to have in 2020 and beyond is there is a social aspect to work. It’s nice to be in an office with people sometimes and it’s nice to be able to talk to people and interact with other people. I think working from home can be quite a lonely experience and I think it is an area of concern for a lot of companies. So when we realized that we could actually replicate quite a lot of that environment, but also assuage any concerns from our legal department or HR department about free licensing unit for people to generate their own content and to put some rails and guidance up, I think it was really helpful because we were able to go to those people in our Facebook environment and say, “We’ve recreated this environment for you in Magellan Now,” and we recreated certain channels that were performing well in Facebook and they continue to perform well in SocialChorus.
Alex Rose: Some of them are work related, some of them are purely social. Some of them are kind of halfway in between advocacy groups and things like that. I think our number one channel for social is our pets of Magellan channel, which is sharing pictures of pets. I’m sure anyone at Magellan who’s listening to that will flinch because pets of Magellan is somewhat infamous for being the runaway success on some of our projects. Once you go into that, it also helps with that social interaction.
Alex Rose: For example, just recently, so up until the pandemic, our St Louis office was by far our biggest office. They’ve largely gone to working from home. There are some people and the office is still open, but most folks aren’t there. So they were losing out on some of that office culture that they had. And we noticed that they were running their annual costume competition for Halloween through Magellan Now, which we didn’t organize. That wasn’t something that communications organized, it was something that grew organically, which we love to see.
Alex Rose: The other thing that we’ve been doing in there, which again I just adore, is we have a leader mentorship and training program and it’s peer to peer. That team that organizes that were able to set up channels and allow the folks participating in that program to share their content together in their own channels, its own little private environment. And again, the more people we can get in, it’s a great way to teach them how to use the program. While they’re there to look at their pictures of kittens or they’re in their cooking group and they want to talk about food, by the way, benefits season’s open, make sure you do everything. The new employee survey’s open, make sure you do that. They have to scroll past all of that to get to what they want. It’s great for our traffic. I’m sure it’s a key part of the success we’ve seen over the last few months.
Chuck Gose: Yeah. Sometimes, as you know, you just have to give people what they want. If they want cooking, if they want pets, as someone who adopted a senior dog during the pandemic, I would be blowing up the feed with pictures of B-Dog in there. And you’re right, that’s that’s what people now want is this sense of community, that they’ve lost some of that geographic sense, or they might, for those who could go into an office, they might’ve lost some of that, but they can still get some of that.
Chuck Gose: I love the example you shared with the St. Louis office doing the costume contest. That’s something that sounds very local based, very culture based that they would have done had they been in the office. So why not replicate that and use that platform to keep those connections in place? That and the pets and again, some people might label that stuff is trivial, but it’s only trivial if it doesn’t matter to you. To the people that it matters, they want that, they crave that type of interaction. So kudos to Magellan for allowing that and encouraging that type of content in there.
Alex Rose: Yeah, yeah. It’s one of those things, it can be a nice place to be. Magellan, it’s a nice place to work and I think it’s not one big thing, it’s lots and lots of little things. I think that’s a good example of that. It’s fun to take 10 seconds to look at a couple of pictures. You’re still in a work environment, you can still go in, just like when we were in an office environment, it’s fun to take a few minutes to talk to a coworker about their weekend at the coffee machine. We’ve lost so much of that. It’s nice to be able to deliver something that helps and I really do feel that it does.
Chuck Gose: With mental health and mental wellness being at the forefront, that can only help those people that are struggling with those connections to build that. So we spent some time talking about the culture and the communications at Magellan Health. You did a great job of walking through all that. The podcast is called Culture, Comms and Cocktails, Alex. So I’m curious, what is your favorite cocktail or has there been a cocktail of your pandemic that you’ve been experimenting with?
Alex Rose: I don’t know I can say there’s been a cocktail of the pandemic. I had to think about this. You did pre-warn me about this question, so I was thinking about it and then I did realize that vast majority of… Instead of a cocktail, I am a rye whiskey kind of guy. I realize I’m sitting here with a lumberjack beard and shirt on and I couldn’t sound like more of a hipster if I tried. An old fashioned maybe, but probably I’m going to grumble about there being stuff in my whiskey. It would probably just end up being a straight rye.
Chuck Gose: Nothing wrong with that. I’m also a whiskey fan, big bourbon fan out there, so nothing wrong with keeping it neat. Alex, again, I want to thank you for being on the podcast. We spoke before we recorded this, I’m really proud that I did not call you Axl Rose, even though your name is Alex Rose. When I first saw it I was like, “Axl Rose, that’s awesome.” But Alex, again, thank you for taking the time to talk through this, doing all the great work there at Magellan Health and kudos to you and the team for giving people this platform. They told you what they wanted, right? That’s the beauty of surveys. The value is taking that feedback and saying, “You told us this, now we’ve gone and done this for you,” and it’s showing that by delivering on that, you’ve now won over the hearts and minds of employees there.
Alex Rose: Well, let’s hope so, right?
Chuck Gose: And again, thank you for being on the podcast. I hope you and your family stay healthy.
Alex Rose: Same to you and thank you very much for having me.
Chuck Gose: If you enjoyed what you heard from this episode and want to check out others, find Culture, Comms and Cocktails on Apple podcasts, Google Play, Spotify, or wherever you like to listen. When you do, hit that subscribe button so you don’t miss any future episodes. This has been Culture, Comms and Cocktails; internal comms served straight up. Thanks for listening.